Tuesday, March 12, 2013

Some Good News!


No, not my tooth, but......

#2 Son passed his Driver's road test on Saturday!
And there was much rejoicing through the land.....






Now I get to have my car insurance bill raised a bazillion $s for another under age 25 driver, and a male one at that.
Ugh.
At least #1 Son will be getting kicked off the car insurance in the not too distant future, as soon as he graduates and procures a real job.  Until then, he's still on the plan but paying for his share of it as soon as he graduates.

But it's good to have all of them FINISHED with the trials of learning to drive.  At least Hubs is glad that part of parenting is finished with for him.  Yes, he taught all of them to drive.  I volunteered to do it but after Daughter ran into the front of the CVS that time, for some reason nobody wants me to teach them anymore.  Good thing, because I don't think my nerves could have taken it. lol

More money going out to the big car insurance company.
The trade off is no more having to chauffeur the kids around to lessons, jobs, practices and friends houses.
Yes....yes, I can live with that! ;-)

And we are the evil parents who do NOT buy new cars for the kids when they get their licenses.
From what my kids have always told me, we are the ONLY people on the planet who don't reward their kids thus.  ALL their friends' parents buy them new cars.
Right.
Who would do that?......give an expensive machine to a 16 year old without a fully developed brain?
Please tell me that I am not the only one who thinks that this would be a silly idea.

But then again, I keep thinking back to that first case in the 1980's where a Long Island teen killed his father because he made the son drive one of their old cars to school and not the new car.
We hear about one or two of these situations every year now, along with teens killing their parents over not letting them do other things, like date some one or throw a party, etc.
Obviously these kids haven't been raised right to begin with and in order to keep the peace(such that it is)it's easier to just give in and pray the kid leaves home as soon as they turn 18.

I find it disheartening and sad though, what our culture and peer pressure, if given full reign over the parental authority, can turn our young people into.

At any rate the car deal here is thus......
We, the parents do NOT buy you a car just because you get your license.  We have a 3rd car you can drive but you have to work out scheduling with your sibling, who is also driving that car.   We pay for the insurance and maintenance.  You pay for the gas, unless you are driving to school, then we pay that part of the gas expense.
#2 Son has grumbled a bit but he knows he has it better than some.  One of his friends is not allowed(per his parents)to get his license until he can pay his share of the car insurance.  This is in addition to any gas he uses.
Finding this out gives me a little leverage.....I can always threaten to make him pay for his share of the insurance should his grades take a nosedive due to all the joyriding he'll want to be doing now. ;-)

So tell me, if money were no object, would you give your newly minted teenage driver a new vehicle?
What about the other costs of a car?......would you as the parent pick up the costs of registration, gasoline, insurance and maintenance too?
Would you have any conditions attached to the car and it's use?

Sluggy


39 comments:

  1. Do what you want BUT, I never permitted my girls to sit in anyone else's car E V E R! I never permitted any one else to drive my daughters anywhere. I would never gamble the lives of my precious children to anyone else. If you don't get your kids their own cars, guess what they do? They jam pack into other kids vehicles and guess what happens?

    I have a friend who wouldn't get his son his own car, not even a limo rental for prom, so he went in another teen's car on prom night and was killed. I had to watch this couple suffer for decades over the loss of their only son. No thanks! Not for me.

    Hubby and I bought our daughters older car BUT in extremely good condition. My daughters worked on side jobs and paid for their own insurance. They were forbidden to have any of their friends in their car and were never in an accident until once:
    I asked my daughter to go to the store for me. She asked if she could go pick up the grocery item in her friends car who just happened to be over. I reluctantly said yes and within two hours I got the phone call every parents dreads. My daughter and her friend was in a head on collision with a Range Rover. Her girlfriend's car had bald tires, it started to drizzle and the car just skidded into oncoming traffic.
    If the girls didn't have seatbelts on, both would have died.
    How's that for a nightmare. One time I messed up and gave permission for my daughter to ride in someone else's nightmare!!!!!

    My daughter was in shock, didn't even know who I was. At the hospital, when her girlfriends mother came in, she immediately started to complain to me that her daughter dropped out of high school, wasn't working and now the mother had to pay medical bills. I just looked at the mother square in her eyes and said "Your daughter has a broken leg, ankle, black eye and a messed up chin and almost died today and your complaining about some stupid insurance expense??? Fuck you!" And yes! We sued!
    Don't be so smug, sluggy. The lives of my children are more important to me than any cost their driving may incur. If I had the money, I'd have bought my girls Mercedes Benz.
    Just think how awful your own life would be if your kids got hurt, maimed or killed.

    Have them work over the summer, save up and buy them their own used cars, teach them how to change a tire, change the oil and be responsible. But whatever you do, do NOT let them get in another teen's car.

    PS: a few months ago, again, my older daughter went in her friends car to drive to a lake house for the weekend. Guess what? They were in some freakin' accident. Again I screamed my bloody head off and told her and her husband they can either borrow one of my two cars whenever they wanted to or rent a car. They have been using zip car rentals ever since.(Since they live in NYC, they don't own a car). It's just not worth trusting your life to someone else!!!!!

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    1. Just how am I being smug because I wouldn't buy my teens a new car? Getting my kid a new car has nothing to do with them not having a car to drive, nor our rules for them in regards to driving and being a passenger(or not)in a car belonging to their friends.

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  2. I just sat through a mandatory teen safety seminar with my son. (My last one too!) It is required in our county to sit through this 90 minute presentation of what to expect with your teen driver, what you should do as a parent, etc. etc. I left there all red eyed because there were several small movies of kids who were texting and killed.
    Anyway, one of the points that they made was that it was a BAD idea to give a new driver a car. Kids that drive a 'family' car, or a third car are 75% less likely to be in an accident. (Something to share with your son!)
    So, Sluggy, maybe it's just you and me who are the only parents who don't give cars to their teenagers. By the way, we don't even have a third family car! :)!

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    1. Sharon, If I am correct, that's the same film/seminar thing(or a version of it) I sat through before I was allowed to get my license at 16 in VA.
      After you passed the road test they didn't hand over your license at the DMV. You had to go to the courthouse a week or two later and sit through a film and a lecture by State Troopers and a Judge so they could scare the fear of God into you! lol If you made it through that, you got your license.
      I'm glad to see they are still doing something like this.

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    2. Yes! They are doing the exact same thing. They didn't just scare my kids, by the way. I was PETRIFIED to drive after being at the courthouse! :)! I got my license in NY. It was a bit easier!

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  3. Even if money was not an object, I wouldn't give a child a car, not because I don't trust them to be responsible and be more developed than their counterparts and the statistics (which they probably arent anyway), but because I don't think they need to have a 10k machine at their disposal without being able to afford it themselves. Same reason young kids wont get all the latest and greatest toys, games, phones and computers.

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    1. I agree Tanner....it sets a bad precedent of a reward far greater than the effort. If you give them a new car at 16, what's next?....a 3 month Summer Vacation to Europe for graduating at 18?.....buy them a house when they get married?

      I believe that people appreciate rewards more when they have some skin in the game.

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  4. If money were no object, I would buy a new car for only one reason--my peace of mind as to its safety. However, it would be a very plain, white car, no red or black because they are not visible and too cool. It would be an old lady car, not anything the kid would want to show off. Too bad. Gas would be the teen's problem, even to school. Okay, if school were far away,I would kick in for school travel. Other expenses I would probably take care of.

    Conditions? You obviously don't know me very well. Grades would be tied to car use, so would attitude and doing chores when asked and correctly and without grumbling.

    My friend would not take her teen's car away because the teen worked and was paying for it. However, I know a sixteen-year-old cannot have her name on a title or obtain insurance. I have a different take on the situation.

    There would be lots of strings!

    Type of car--my sister's daughter wrecked two red Mustangs even though she was a good driver. Both wrecks involved the front corner of the passenger side. My sister drove the car and found she could not tell where the front of car was because of the slope of the car and my sister and niece were short and the seat sat low. So, my sister bought her daughter a car that was not cool, white, and one that they both could find the front end of the car.

    In Tennessee, 16 is legal driving age. My sister refused to allow her daughter to drive until she was 18. That child had such a heartbreaking story to tell me about her mean mother. I laughed.

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    1. I think every parent has conditions on their teen being allowed to drive....or should!
      I'm sure your niece believed her tale of woe was unbearable. lol

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  5. We don't have kids yet, but think we will probably follow my parent's lead with what they did for us: bought us very inexpensive, but reliable cars around 17/18. They didn't have a third car and this allowed all three of us to get jobs. They paid the insurance. We paid gas. Of course this always was contingent on good grades/behavior. Never a problem though! These first cars lasted my brother sister and I well into college, and for my brother and sister, I think the it's well after. Once we graduated college/got a job, insurance, etc all on us. For our first "grown up" cars that WE purchased on our own (early twenties, job, etc), my parents graciously paid for the car(nothing extravagant!) and we paid them to save on interest as they knew we were starting out, etc. Drives me NUTS seeing these 16 year olds driving their own brand new cars, no responsibility. It is beginning to show in our society that this generation needs to learn this type of responsibility.

    Michelle

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    1. Your parents sound like they handled the teen driver thing well.
      I was also lucky in that my father bought me a new car after I graduated from college. It was a Chevette.....no glam, but it had wheels and brakes and got me from point A to point B. lol

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  6. IF money was no option, I would STILL not buy a NEW car for my kids when they turn 16... Why wreck a new car? They're just going to get in an accident or swerve for a deer anyway and flip it within a month...
    For now, we have a beater car they can use until they can afford something of their own that they'll care about more.

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    1. Exactly! Why buy them a new car that they'll just roll or go into a ditch in. I say the parent gets the new car to roll and go into a ditch in.... ;-)

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  7. Honestly you ran her (or she ran you into CVS) Okay I'll quit laughing. I make hubs teach the driving here also. We also don't buy cars. We will help but they pay for them.

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    1. Daughter "claims" I raised my voice when she didn't pull into the parking space fully(she was hanging out into the road!), so she hit the go pedal too hard and then got confused between the pedals and instead of hitting the brake, she hit the go pedal again, thus having the front of my car make contact with the pole supporting the awning on the CVS building.
      This story has grown and become legend and Daughter and #2 Son refused to let me teach them(though I am the better driver between Hubs and I).
      I can't say that I am not happy about NOT having to handle the teaching of the Daughter, as she is a mite highstrung....;-)

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  8. Slugs, I drove to school (on the few occasions my brother was home sick or something and let me use his car) the relegated-family-wagon, a puke-green Pinto wagon (OK, yes, I am showing my age... yet, it was an OLD car, OK?) and it had a cross-shaped bandage taped on it and the word "ouch" scrawled alongside.

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    1. Oh, I am sure that Pinto was a sight to see....lol
      I once had a loaner car as a teen while my car was in the shop. The loaner car was a Pinto.....I guess they didn't value their customers very much, huh? lol

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  9. Our kids arent allowed to own a car till college and only if they are living at home. Then they must pay for half and we will pay for other half up to a certain amount. We pick the car. They have to work in summer to pay car insurance and save for gas and repairs. If they cant they cant drive. Plus we make them take a safe driving course

    So see I am much meaner than you!

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    1. Oh, I don't think you are meaner.
      I didn't even BEGIN to list our conditions under which the teens here can drive or ride! lol
      Can we be equally mean? ;-)

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  10. Our little one is getting a Mustang when she turns 16 (daddy has decided this) so I'm already saving money for that. Nothing wrong with your child having a nice car but you have to teach them responsibility.

    HS

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    1. I just don't think it's prudent to give a brand new car, even if you can afford it and the teen is responsible.
      But we can agree to disagree. 8-)

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  11. "Who would do that?......give an expensive machine to a 16 year old without a fully developed brain?"-NEVER!
    We are meaner to our kids than you are. We make them pay for car insurance and in order to have driving privileges they have to stay on the honor roll. DJ is driving a 1999 lumina with a different color hood. And I think he is spoiled. He doesn't.
    And we are now making them pay for their own cell phones. I might actually be the devil. But we put gas in the car while they are in high school. DJ doesn't do much so its fine, Anna had a large social circle and we regretted that deal. She is now paying for everything herself except for the college bill. I should have found a way to make her pay that one too. ;)

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    1. I have always made our teens pay for their own cell phones.
      So we are equally the devil now!!
      But you beat me on the making them pay for the car insurance.....that's only because Hubs gives in on that one point. lol

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    2. Wow this is a popular post!
      We devils should meet up and drink once we ditch the kids. Den and I have a list of fun stuff to do once we are kid free. It will be frugal fun but fun!

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  12. Sluggy, curious how old is your son? My oldest is now 16 and we aren't even going there YET! I won't buy him a phone and I most certainly won't buy him a car. And yes, money isn't the issue!

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    1. Sheila, he just turned 17. He got his permit at 16.5.....we didn't feel he was ready at 16 and he wasn't really clammbering for it so we waited.
      My oldest son was also in no hurry for his license, but the daughter was chomping at the bit the day she was old enough. lol
      I have never bought my teens phone service.....1 of them got an actual phone for Christmas(they wanted it)but I didn't pay for it's use.

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  13. We are also the ONLY parents my son knows who did not buy him a car for his 16th birthday! We have the EXACT same deal with our son that you have - only we don't pay gas money for him to drive to school, because he has the option of riding the bus for free. Though, now that track season has started and I have to pick him up after practice every day, I am reconsidering this decision. My husband bought a 3rd vehicle for our family which is a 20 year old beat up truck that our son drives, but he does not own. I found that generous - when I was 17 I was going to school, working, and making car payments on a used car loan that my dad co-signed, so I could get some credit in my own name.

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    1. I'm just curious to know where you live.....is it a suburban, affluent or affluent-wannabe area? We live in a tiny town but it is sort of affluent. I can't believe the makes/age of the cars I see parked in the parking lot at the high school....and I KNOW those new expensive cars aren't the teachers cars!lol The teens are given cars that are better than the cars their teachers drive.....


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    2. We live in the wealthiest county in the U.S. - Loudoun County, VA. We are in a typical suburban neighborhood, surrounded by rural but wealthy estates and horse breeders. My son's school parking lot is also filled with late model expensive cars driven by students, and the student parking fee is $200 per year!

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    3. Children cannot own vehicles, even if they work and make the payments.

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    4. I think that varies from state to state. According to the Virginia Department of Motor Vehicles a minor can be an owner of a vehicle and there is no age restriction for registering, titling or insuring a vehicle in your name.

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  14. We are on our last kid out of 4! The kids take drivers ed at 14 1/2, we live in Idaho. They then have to drive for 6 months with an adult, that has taken affect after kid #2. They get a day license till they turn 16 when they can drive at night. Our rules: they drive my old beater rig for a year, we live on a farm, thats all I have, lol! They have all done 4-H, so their market sale money goes towards their vehicle, which they pay for themselves. Kid #3 just bought a truck. They have to have jobs to pay for fuel and repairs. We pay insurance if they are playing a sport, other wise they pitch in for insurance. They have to maintain a 3.0 GPA, which helps their insurance costs. We live in the country so not alot of traffic, but bad roads in the winter and wildlife. Kids do get killed in our area, but I believe if you start them young when you can micro-manage them, they are better educated when they go into the world at 18. Our oldest is 27 and our youngest is 14 1/2 in drivers ed right now. So far this has worked great for us, no accidents or tickets yet, knock on wood!! Education and EXPERIENCE is the key, the LONGER they drive the better they get! I would be scared shitless sending my kid out at 18 just learning to drive, with no restrictions or supervision! Just my 2 cents!

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    1. If I lived in Idaho, I'd probably be ok with teens driving at 14.5(with the having to drive with an adult stipulation for 6 months....is that your rule or an Idaho law?). Like you said, not a lot of traffic.
      Around here?....I don't think that would fly. Too many vehicles and bad drivers.
      It all comes down to each teen being ready on their own time table....many kids just aren't mature enough at 15 or 17 or whenever. You have to be sensitive to when the time is right.
      And the more experience the better is always correct, no matter the teen!

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    2. My grandson in NYC us eighteen but I don't believe he has ever been behind the wheel of a car or wants to drive. He has feet and a bus pass. Both of his parents own vehicles, but my daughter would probably not let him behind the wheel of hers. I think he should have a license and be driving. But, I have never expressed this opinion to her. His Daddy drives like a maniac and scare me with his language and jerking the car around. My daughter needs to see how the son drives before he leaves for college this fall. I don't think he needs a car at this point. Lots of NYers never have cars.

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    3. Sluggy that is the new Idaho rule, driving with an adult over 21 for 50 hrs. and 6 months. Our two oldest now 27 & 23 didn't have that restriction. I just think the longer you supervise their driving and whereabouts the better off you are. Nothing hurts more than taking keys away and pointing them towards the school bus after they have started driving. We have mature kids because they have been working for us on the farm and for other people for awhile, along with playing sports and getting good grades. The disadvantage of having older kids is that I have expectations of the younger ones to step up. Compared to their friends, I don't see that as a bad thing!

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  15. I really am the devil! We did not buy our kids cell phones or cars. If they wanted a cell phone, they had to pay for it themselves. And if they got jobs, they had to keep their grades up. Mere got a job an her first paycheck went to buy a cellphone. Samantha didn't want one until she went to college. LOL!

    As for cars, Hubby's car was available for the kids to use until we bought him a new car and kept the old one for Sam to use. She was the only one living with us at the time. Sam totaled it one week later. She did without a car for several months until we bought one for her to use. It was not new and she had to pay for insurance and gas. WE paid for maintenance. And she was such a bad driver that we had to have a LOT of work done on that car.

    We were so glad when she decided she needed to own a car, so went and financed one. Then it was not our problem anymore.

    See, much meaner.

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  16. We live in an affluent area and my son's best friend just got a 23000$ sports car which costs his parents 4000$ in insurance. Now he wants a high cost stereo system.

    My son also got his insurance a few months ago when he turned 17 and is driving my hubby's car to school and he may be getting a 5-6K car in the summer if he goes to a local college. If not, he will get a car after 2 years in college (if he keeps his grades up). We are paying for gas and insurance and his job is to keep his grade at 4.0 or close to that.

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  17. Ha!!!! We CANN afford to buy our kids cars, but will not. We have 1 family car for 2 drivers (hubby and me.) He is retired, I am a SAHM. So far, we have yet to justify a second parental vehicle, so no kid car. If they want to borrow ours, fine, provided they have had a good behavior record, (grades, etc) and we know the who, what, where and when of the destination. When they graduate from college, and find that first "real " job in a place with no public transit, then maybe, if necessary, we will cosigning a loan for a reliable vehicle. Yeah, I am mean, but a kid car would be simply convenience....as would a second vehicle. I prefer to spend the $$$$ on their education so they can earn their own money. Then, they can buy whatever they want....but I bet they won't!
    Mrs. B.

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